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 ragtime |
C42 rudder lost |
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Posts: 131 01/03/07 18:25:00 |
I was reading the log of "L'Attitude" a C42 that was in the Caribbean 1500. They made the voyage just fine but are reporting that they lost their rudder in Puerto Rico. From the pictures it appears to be a Mark 1. There aren't any details as to why it happened and apparently the rudder and shaft were not recovered. The website is www.sharethesail.com.
Gerry Ragtime C42 108 |
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sashay567 |
Re: C42 rudder lost | #1 | ||
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Posts: 188 01/04/07 10:27:28 |
I am beginning to get a little concerned regarding all these rudder failures with our boats. I was crew on Irish Lady on the Pacific Cup. Irish Lady lost its rudder on the return trip back to SF. A cruising aquaintance recounted rescueing 2 C-42s with lost rudders, one off of the Marquesas, and one off of New Zealand. PK Edward's boat has lost 2 rudders. Moonspun lost its rudder on the way to Hawaii with one of the first high aspect MkII rudders. And now L'Attitude. Who knows how many others there are.
I don't know if Catalina Yachts monitors this board but I hope someone from their engineering department will weigh in. While I can't talk about Irish Lady's failure and the root causes until insurance issues are cleared up, the point of failure is known and common to other failures. I for one am just a bit concerned. Rodney Kidd, C-42 #567 Sashay, 2 Cabin Fin, Marina Village, Alameda, CA
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chrisgarraway |
Re: C42 rudder lost | #2 | ||
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Posts: 37 01/04/07 11:04:52 |
I would agree, re some info from Catalina, but I doubt you will get it since you have developed the " sue at all opportunities" culture rather well in the States.
I love my newish Mk1 three cab wing keeler but have to say that the rudder design appears to be something out of the dark ages! No wonder there are so many instances of weather helm and general sloppiness , rather like the old Japenese cars that had worm and peg steering. It`s the one thing that would make me consider changing back to a different yacht type ( like the Danish X Yachts for example) The fact that there seem to be to many instances of actual failure is very worrying indeed -- I guess we can cope with many breakages on passage but a lost rudder is not to be reccommended. |
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gquilici |
C42 rudder lost | #3 | ||
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Posts: 6 01/04/07 11:28:49 |
Reading back in thier log in August they damaged the rudder in a grounding and had it repaired. This itime it's probablly not a Catalina design issue.
GregQ Dona 3 cabin |
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sashay567 |
Re: C42 rudder lost | #4 | ||
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Posts: 188 01/04/07 12:18:37 |
Greg, I hadn't read the whole log, thanks for pointing out the fact that L'Attitude had suffered a grounding damaging the rudder.
Chris, wholeheartedly agree regarding our US litigious society. It does get in the way of honest and open communications. Rodney Kidd, C-42 #567 Sashay, 2 Cabin Fin, Marina Village, Alameda, CA
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yorkrose |
Re: C42 rudder lost | #5 | ||
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Posts: 250 01/04/07 15:17:51 |
Since both the rudder and rudder stock were lost it seems likely that the retaining bolts came loose and the entire assembly simply fell out of the hole. If that is the case then the culprit would most likely be poor reinstallation technique after the repair.
The few other C42 rudder problems I can recall reading about were all some sort of break in the rudder or rudder stock. I have never previously heard of the entire assembly disappearing. Regards, Gene Fuller Yorkshire Rose, C42 #870 |
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melelana |
Re: C42 rudder lost | #6 | ||
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Posts: 323 01/04/07 16:45:58 |
Not certain the entire stock came out. WIth and autopilot arm you have no less than 3 cross bolts (top roller, tiller arm, quadrant). You'll also "see blue water" looking through a hollow shaft broken off.
Most of you know I have looked into alternatives to the existing shoal keel rudder. It's not hard and the cost could be pretty close to Catalina's cost for a new shoal rudder, given 15-20 buyers to share mold and design costs. I've just been too busy at work since early summer to give it much time. Maybe I'll find some time this spring to dig up my notes. As I recall, non recurring costs were a bit more than $5,000. After that, production costs were comparable to the existing rudder. A full package with roller bearings is probably too big a mod for most of us, but improvements can be had. Larry
Melelana Catalina 42 #175 1990 3cbn, wk Solomons, MD |
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do335 |
Re: C42 rudder lost | #7 | ||
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Posts: 249 01/04/07 17:55:50 |
One thing to keep in mind about multiple reports of rudder failure on the C42 is the number of boats out there. There are more C42's floating today than many other boats so you can expect to have more rudder failures reported even if the percentage is low.
Steve 642-2f TESA
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melelana |
Re: C42 rudder lost | #8 | ||
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Posts: 323 01/04/07 20:06:40 |
Steve,
Excellent point. 940 plus boats up to 17 years old. Not really a tremendous number of rudder failures. Larry
Melelana Catalina 42 #175 1990 3cbn, wk Solomons, MD |
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tomcharron2 |
Re: C42 rudder lost | #9 | ||
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Posts: 42 01/05/07 00:15:00 |
It is interesting to hear the anecdotal comments on the rudder failure issue of C42's.
If a total of +/-940 C42's have been built in 17 years then...."reported" rudder failures may (to some) seem a small percentage of the total. But to really evaluate the situation and to be inclusive and fair, we must consider in the total pool those here-to-fore not yet mentioned "unreported" rudder failures. Also many (if not most) of these 940 C42's rudders have. if ever, never been put to the test of sailing in difficult and stressful blue water conditions for extended periods of time. I do not desire to experience Rudder Failure as reported by some in this discussion board and elsewhere when sailing....especially when sailing far from my home port....away from assistance and support....in some far corner of the planet. To evaluate and calculate rudder failure one must classify use of the vessel(s) and stresses endured by the rudders of a particular comparable experienced group of C42's.....Not the whole group of C42 boats (most which never see extensive blue water stressful conditions). In addition one must apply an unbiased technical expert panel review of the design engineering of a C42 (fin keel separate from winged keel) rudder and apply current engineering design standards (if any) to the equasion. So the verdict is still out and a good statistical review of rudder failure in 'equally blue water stressed rudder history C42's'.... in conjunction with design engineering a comprehensive review (mentioned above) remains to be conducted. I with-hold definitive position on all this until appropriate engineering/statistical review of C42 rudder failure is conducted. Tom Charron MiVida C42 631 tomcharron@alamedanet.net 
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davidirvine |
Rudder breakage | #10 | ||
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Posts: 55 01/05/07 10:08:11 |
I agree Catalina need to give us their view on this. No rudder failure is acceptable. Forget the low percentage argument. Many builders use a solid stainless tube as a rudder stock. Look at the Halberg Rassy site . They actually show how they build their rudder .
David 492 mk 2 |
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