SSB Radio Installation

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sashay567

#11

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Posts: 200

11/19/07 09:24:21

All,

I have tested for RF "bites" from the lifelines, stern pushpit, etc., while transmitting with an Icom M-802 at full power (150 watts) by grabbing bare metal with my hands. I experienced no bites or burns - at least at the frequencies I tested. I would think that the lifelines being attached to a good sea water ground would minimize that effect. That being said, there could possibly be some combination of frequency and tuner state that could create a "bite" effect. During my tests, I thought that the tuner might re-tune, but that never happened either. The fact that the tuner did not re-tune suggest that the sea water ground was effective. Practically, a simple warning to topside passengers & crew would minimize any danger. BTW, on the recent Ha Ha, the event's daily net was on SSB channel 4A, 4.146 Mhz. The boats using ham rigs were easy to pick out... they were always slightly off frequency.

I use my Icom M710-RT on the ham bands frequently with good reports, especially regarding the audio. Using an M802 on the ham bands is easy. Opening the M802 for ham frequencies is a simple 3 button power up sequence.

Rodney Kidd
K6YOT
C-42 #567 Sashay
2 Cabin Fin, Marina Village,
Alameda, CA

Last Edited By: sashay567 11/19/07 09:31:03. Edited 1 time.

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captrick

#12

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Posts: 198

11/25/07 07:21:35

I have an Icom 706 with the original SCS modem with P3 mod, grounded to the strut, a gound plate and the pushpit as described. I agree with all the comments posted but would add 1 more issue. I was eating zincs on the strut and found a small DC offset between the tuner and ground plate, probably from the voltage drop in the power wiring to the radio. I added an isolation capacitor in the copper strap befor attaching it to the strut and ground plate. It's a special design that I found on the web using many small caps wired in parallel on a small PC board. This has solved the problem and makes me feel more comfortable about unpredictable galvanic problems. It does seem to have hurt my performance a bit however and the boat is a bit hotter for RF than before, but I have not tried modifying the cap design. FYI.

Rick 704-3
Mazatlan

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svzephyr44

#13

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Posts: 113

11/25/07 13:10:18

Since this topic is still open let me add one additional comment. One of the reasons that I mounted the transceiver in the stern rather than in the main cabin was that I have an Autohelm "core" autopilot computer. In fact I have a new one! One possible reason - Autohelm computers do not like to be near RF. In one of my "breadboard" implementations I had coax running along the top of the cabin (2 stateroom) from the chart table over the power panel (inside of the power panel is the location of my autopilot computer) and out to the antenna tuner. Well, after a few trial transmissions the autopilot didn't want to work anymore. Eventually the problem was identified as the autopilot computer. Now, let me be clear - the computer was 10 years old. It might have died from RF, it might have died from many other possibilities. However, I am now cautious enought to keep the RF as much as possible concentrated in the stern of the boat.

In addition, I have discovered that the autopilot creates interference in the transceiver when it is doing the steering. I get a very strong audio spike when the autopilot is engaged. It is very pronounced at 14.3 mhz (who needs that frequency anyway!) I have not had a chance to debug the cause, at the moment I simply have someone hand steer if I need to use airmail or talk on the HF.

Roger
REBOOT USA 60493

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pmellen

SSB Radio Installation

#14

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Posts: 16

02/14/08 13:27:09

Earlier this year I received an excellent tutorial on the installation of the grounding system for a SSB radio, primarily from Rodney #567 and Roger #493. Now that I have the radio I have some additional questions before I start this project that hopefully can be answered. The instructions that came with the radio suggest that both the tuner and the raido itself (along with wind & speed instruments, GPS, VHF, etc - the instructions imply that by including these other items into the ground plane it will reduce or eliminate stray RF) be grounded by the copper ground plane foil. In the earlier discussion it seemed that the only thing that was necessary to ground was the antenna tuner itself. I also seem to recall reading in another forum that it was unnecessary to ground the receiver. It certainly will be easier if I only need to ground the tuner, but I want to do it right. I appreciate all of the advice I have received from those who know and understand what they are doing with SSB radios and have successfully installed them.

Paul Mellen, #480 Saltwater Taffy

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sashay567

#15

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Posts: 200

02/14/08 18:13:53

Paul,

In my experience installing ham & SSB radios onboard boats, I would not recommend connecting anything but the tuner to to the copper groundplane/counterpoise. Doing so is likely to establish "ground loops" which are essentially multiple paths for signals to ground. Some people even advocate not connecting the grounding wire from the tuner (included in the tuner control cable) to the tranciever though in practice, I have found the cable ground doesn't seem to make any difference. Copious use of ferrite beads on the tuner control cables will go along way to preventing problems. I also have a "shopping list" of additional items needed for a successful install. I will post it here in the next day or two.

Have fun,
Rodney

Rodney Kidd, C-42 #567 Sashay, 2 Cabin Fin, Marina Village, Alameda, CA

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pmellen

SSB Radio Installation

#16

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Posts: 16

02/15/08 08:23:57

Rodney, Thanks for the quick response. I cannot begin to express how great it is to hear that only the tunner needs to be grounded. I will be looking for your "shopping list". I need also to thank everyone who has offered suggestions on how best to accomplish this project. Without all of your help this would have been a monumental project with so many traps and pitfalls that it would be almost impossible for me to accomplish. I'll keep you posted on the results as I go through with it. As warmer weather sets in, I'll get moving.

Paul

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sashay567

SSB Shopping List (long)

#17

[-]

Posts: 200

02/29/08 13:08:31

I promised to list the additional items needed for a successful SSB install. This list assumes that you are installing a SCS TNC to use with Sailmail or Winlink.

In addition to the SSB radio, tuner, and tuner control cable, you will need:

1 roll	Copper Foil	N/A	http://www.hfradio.com/Stores/radioemail_store.html	65.00
30 feet	RG8X Double Shield	RG8XDouble Shield	www.radioworks.com Click on price list.	0.42/foot 12.60
2	PL259ST Coax Connector	PL259S	www.radioworks.com Click on price list.	1.49 each 5.96
2	Silver plated inserts for Coax Connector	UG176S	www.radioworks.com Click on price list.	0.49 each 1.96
1	T-4-500 Line Isolator, 3' Coax jumper, and ¼" Ferrite Cores	RFI Kit #2	www.radioworks.com Click on price list. The line isolator is installed in the coax cable running from the SSB to the tuner. Install at the tuner end of the cable.	55.00
1	Weatherproofing kit	N/A	www.radioworks.com Click on price list.	19.95
1	SCS Pactor II Modem with Pactor III installed	Pactor II USB (0.1)	http://www.hfradio.com/Stores/radioemail_store.html Omit if not installing Sailmail/Winlink	1098.00
1	Pactor II Cable & Support Kit for M802	98882 (0.2)	http://www.hfradio.com/Stores/radioemail_store.html Omit if not installing Sailmail/Winlink	215.00
20 feet	GTO15 Antenna Lead	GTO15	http://www.hfradio.com/Stores/radioemail_store.html Use to connect the tuner to the backstay.

Alternative Source for Pactor Modem & Cables (omit if not installing Sailmail/Winlink)

1

SCS Pactor II Modem with Pactor III installed

1061

http://www.farallon.us/webstore/

On sale now otherwise $1098. Replaces same item above

Farallon Electronics is located in Sausalito

888.00

1

Icom M802 Audio Cable

9090

http://www.farallon.us/webstore/

Replaces Pactor II Cable & Support Kit above.

39.00

1

Icom M802 Control Cable

8083

http://www.farallon.us/webstore/

Replaces Pactor II Cable & Support Kit above.

30.00

Optional DSC Watch Antenna

1

Metz Weather Fax/General Coverage Antenna

Metz P/N 201

http://www.pyacht.net/cgi-local/SoftCart.exe/cgi-bin/pagegen.pl?U+scstore+tspp1890ff341834+pr+metss5.html

64.95

30 feet

RG8X Premium Coax Cable

www.radioworks.com

Click on price list.

.30/foot

9.00

The optional DSC Watch Antenna is needed for the ICOM m802 if you require the tranciever to receive distress, urgency, and safety DSC messages from other ships and boats. Routine, ship's business, position request, and group calls are handled by the main transceiver receiver circuit. What this mean is if you use the m802 to generate a DSC distress message, and you don't have the optional DSC watch antenna connected, you will not hear any acknowledgement that the distress message was received. The distress message WILL be sent however. All normal DSC messages will be received without this optional antenna. FWIW, I have never seen the optional antenna installed.

Prices were current when I compiled this list for DestinySFO last summer.

Rodney Kidd, C-42 #567 Sashay, 2 Cabin Fin, Marina Village, Alameda, CA

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pmellen

SSB Shopping List

#18

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Posts: 16

03/06/08 10:14:40

Thanks much for the list. I haven't started the project yet and this will go a long way to make it easier.

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symandalay

#19

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Posts: 136

03/08/08 04:48:27

Lots of good information in this thread......

If you want a simpler radio at much lower cost which is much more user friendly, you may want to consider an Icom 718 ham radio. There are lots of complaints about the complexity and difficulty of changing to unprogrammed frequencies with the high end marine SSBs.

Colin

Colin

Mandalay Guide to Cruising here http://symandalay.googlepages.com/home

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Dave Bolding

Icom 718 ssb/ham radio

#20

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Posts: 46

03/08/08 09:27:17

Colin, I agree, I installed the Icom 718 2 years ago in preparation for cruising Mexico. We used the A4 tuner along with the GAM backstay antenna. I took the radio to Gordon West to program 100 channels into the radio,( this can be done very easily). He really liked the radio and tested it against the 802 and the 718 put out a stronger signal. While in Mexico the system preformed great. Don Anderson (west coast weather guru,transmitting out of So. Calif.) could be heard in all locations. The system cost around $1100. The Gam backstay antenna slides over the backstay and no need for alteration of the rigging. It measures 34' long. The 718 is a ham radio that receives ssb. By making a simple modifcation to the radio it will also transmit on ssb (this mod can be located on the internet). A simple strip of copper foil was attached from the strut to the tunner, mounted beneath the starboard lazzaret shelf. One of our fellow cruisers also installed this system, he is heading for the south pacific at this time. One side note, we all found that the boats must be away from marinas to use these radio's, way to much noise.

The FCC does not recognize this radio as a legal Marine SSB!!

Cost Breakdown (try gigaparts.com)
Icom 718 Ham/SSB $539
Icom AH4 AntennaTunner $275
GAM BackstayAntenna $275
Misc Hardware $100

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SSB Radio Installation

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